Xenia

[Gilberto]

Eu tinha um empresa com um contrato internacional com outra, a empresa , no caso Italiana, descumpriu o contrato, abriu-se uma ação, foi ganha aqui no Brasil, mas receber que é bom nada.

[Guilherme Torres]

É o famoso ganhou, mas não levou.

Bom, voltemos ao tópico.

 

Ikanda,

Do you have an estimation when you will start selling the xenia espresso machines?

[Iskanda]

 

I quote some details, but it's not because I think your machine needs.

And yes, because you are a person who is to three years thinking about the functions and features of the espresso machine, and with this knowledge any comments can be useful at some point.

 

I appreciate any comment as  (after 3,5 year) I became probabaly blind in some cases.

 

 

The valve ball I thought in a mechanical valve 3-way, thinking a little better about the temperature of the HX, the temperature can be controlled hitting the restrictor size of the escape route, of course, using the above system.

 

 

Hm....it is an idea which is worth to think about it.

[Iskanda]

I have an idea: you could do just like ARM - they just design their processors, they don't have factories. You would sell Xenia's licenses, so other companies could build it.

 

It could be a solution for Brazil or other countries around the world for example.

 

This is not easy to set up. One very very big challenge is to find all partners to produce the parts in the rigth way. It was a kind of nightmare as many many people think that their company is the best in world and can do anything at the best quality. After some weeks or even month you find out that there is a lack of knowledge, machine, raw material,....

 

And I think as we are too small: it will get out of control.

 

As we love to travel and see other counties and people: we prefer to choose some country and can visit them to start the business running with a local partner.

Juba,

Como a coisa não é patenteável, igual o design e a tipografia de um chip (porque se trata, no máximo, de nova técnica), ficaria muito arriscado para ele fazer isso. Não haveria garantia de que a dita empresa não se apropriaria do projeto, alteraria um ou outro detalhe (por exemplo, software e algum sensor), chutaria a licença para bem longe e passaria ela mesma a fabricar sua "versão". Juridicamente até é viável se instaurar um processo por violação de contrato (mas não de patente, no caso). O problema é que processos, no Brasil, são caros, duram anos a fio e, algumas vezes, tem resultados não desejáveis. Eu não toparia.

Ikanda,

Selling parts or the espresso machine itself is one thing. Selling the technique, and licensing to another company to produce it is a very different approach, different worlds. At least at juridical point of view.  

 

 

Juba,

Como a coisa não é patenteável, igual o design e a tipografia de um chip (porque se trata, no máximo, de nova técnica), ficaria muito arriscado para ele fazer isso. Não haveria garantia de que a dita empresa não se apropriaria do projeto, alteraria um ou outro detalhe (por exemplo, software e algum sensor), chutaria a licença para bem longe e passaria ela mesma a fabricar sua "versão". Juridicamente até é viável se instaurar um processo por violação de contrato (mas não de patente, no caso). O problema é que processos, no Brasil, são caros, duram anos a fio e, algumas vezes, tem resultados não desejáveis. Eu não toparia.

 

I agree (at least about what google translated).

Iskanda,

Do you have an estimation when you will start selling the xenia espresso machines?

 

We actually to to come to teh 1st production of 50 maschines. It was scheduled for february/march but teh manufacturer of the glas tanks 'forgot' the production. They will tell me a date in ~2 weeks. As to me...it will take 8-10 weeks until we deliver the 1st machines.

 

If it works and the customers are satiefied - we prepare the next production. This could be june/july/august.

 

If it don't works...time to go back to IT-business

[Iskanda]

Well, my day is finished. I tried to assemble a 2nd machine to use it the next 4 days on the anual meeting of a choir in middle germany (my wife is participating) and I was allowed to dispense Espresso and Cappucchino.

 

But it took too long to find a good setting for the cables (at least more beautiful than in the past) and I was not able to finish and test the machine. May be it is usful to think about the colors, but this will be not my duty.

 

The signal lights (LEDs).
In the middle: the control board installed in a kind of channel which protects the board against the heat. There are long holes to the bottom and top to allow air flow.

 

Toggle switches and LEDs:

 

Pressostat (upper left, black cable)
Level probe boiler (middle/purple cable)
brewgroup thermostat (red cable) and heating catridges 2x150 Watt (blue cable)

 

control unit with more cables:

 

boiler heating (black/red cable)
3 way valve before the HX (blue cable)
to the middle left: the fitting to connect to the HX
ce

 

The central "on/off" with a fuse (not installed yet)

 

security thermostat (blue cable)
to the upper left: security valve and behind: thermostat (red cable) and heating of the brewgroup (blue cable)
to the lower left: exit of the HX and connection (pipe) to the brewgroup.

 

Connection to the circuit (lower right corner):

 

Tomorrow we get hopfully the new rotary pump before we leave our place - else I will install the vibration pump TP600 from ODE.

 

Good night

[Guilherme Torres]

A very beautiful engender and designer work. It pleased my eyes.

[Iskanda]

Thank you very much It was also a pleasure for me to assemble it and before I started it I made all unpleasant work - just to have a free mind.

 

This morning I finished it and can start testing. It is very close to the final 'design':

 

Only some improvements are needed.

[Márcio Martignoni]

Very nice work indeed. Congratulations!

 

Abraços, Márcio.

[Iskanda]

It looks like we can really install the rotationpump with the tank. The new pump is comsuming less space:

 

[Gilberto]

Fantastic.

Actually pumps in general are small, but is accompanied by the motor which is great.

This is a really cool and solves the biggest problem is size and weight.

[Victor Costa]

Hi Iskanda!

As I can see, in the cables and boards organization, I have no doubt that you came from the IT's world. It looks like a rack on a data center. As Guilherme said, it's a pleasure for my eyes!

[Iskanda]

Hi Iskanda!

As I can see, in the cables and boards organization, I have no doubt that you came from the IT's world. It looks like a rack on a data center. As Guilherme said, it's a pleasure for my eyes!

 

thank you.

[Juba]

Nice little pump! Is the motor the black part and the pump is just the small grey part bellow it?

 

https://store-c59cb.mybigcommerce.com/content/Micro%20PRO%20Gear%20Pump_910%20motor_drawing.pdf

[Juba]

Iskanda

 

What is the size of the power supply for the Procon pump? It is 24V DC, right? From the research I made, it is very big.

[Iskanda]

Is the motor the black part and the pump is just the small grey part bellow it? https://store-c59cb.mybigcommerce.com/content/Micro%20PRO%20Gear%20Pump_910%20motor_drawing.pdf

 

This is true.

 

Btw: it works:

 

Iskanda

 

What is the size of the power supply for the Procon pump? It is 24V DC, right? From the research I made, it is very big.

 

It is 230VAC.

 

What is very big ? The pump ? Not really. At least it fits for my machine

[Juba]

It works, great!

 

I thought the motor was 24V DC, as I saw in Procon's website. In that case, a power supply would be necessary and I saw in other forums it is very big.

[Iskanda]

The 24V-version is (as far as I remember) not suitable for the application. Right: a power supply would be needed, as we have 'only' 5 and 12V inside the machine.

 

 

 

 

Mayxbn it is interesring for you: Yesterday we tried to assemble a special kind of measuring device to measure inside the coffee. But we don't know yet if it works. If you like to see it:

 

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.1679586135646178.1073741858.1612085189062940&type=3&ref=notif&notif_t=like

 

It was not very difficulty to assemble.

[Iskanda]

Annotation: The pump is a "MVP with motor 958"

[Juba]

Nice!

 

I could not find the motor in Procon's website, but good to know it works!

 

I saw you also tried a "tradicional" rotatory pump before. What made you change your mind?

[Iskanda]

I saw you also tried a "traditional" rotatory pump before. What made you change your mind?

 

The traditional rotary pump forced the decision: tank or rotary pump. Both was not possible as the space inside the machine ist very limited.

 

The new pumpe is a smaller and so we can offer rotary pump and water tank.

[Eliseu M]

Hi Iskanda, 

 

have you think about an automatic brew ration feature like the LM is adding to their top end machines?

http://www.lamarzoccousa.com/blog/auto-brew-ratio/

 

I'm eager to have a prosumer machine with a built in scale!

 

Thanks

[Juba]

Great idea, I would like to see a home machine with this feature.

[Iskanda]

Hi Iskanda, 

 

have you think about an automatic brew ration feature like the LM is adding to their top end machines?

http://www.lamarzoccousa.com/blog/auto-brew-ratio/

 

I'm eager to have a prosumer machine with a built in scale!

 

Thanks

 

 

No idea...I will read and we can think about it.

 

As we use Solidstaterelais (with zerocrossing) we should be able to do some things by software. But often there is a patent and it will avoid it. We think to deliver the Xenia with a kind of basic software - and release the code as freeware. It meight happen that a team of developers will start implementing new feature. It will be like a 'fork'.

[Iskanda]

There is a patent

[Eliseu M]

Too bad...

[Iskanda]

The problem is 'only' that we can't deliver a machine with a software poviding such a function.

 

But there is no patent of software and the firmware/software could be modified and may be soneome publish one day a new version and you can upload it.

[Juba]

That's nice! 

 

How about the scale hardware? Do you think it is difficult to implement a drip tray with a scale?

[Iskanda]

Actually we work on the second extension board and we can try reserve a port for it. But depending on the space, we will add free (multipurpose) ports in each case.

 

For the final layout of the base board, we have been able to add one additional port for an external solidstaterelais (for what ever we meight need it one day).

And we added 2 ports for 2 addional buttons. The advantage is that we orderrd toggle switches with 3 position:

This allows us - for example - to implement 2 function for brewing:

2->3 = start the shot and wait until the user ends the shot

1<-2 = start the shot and end it after x seconds

 

May be the challenge willl be to find the right scale.

[Iskanda]

Hello,

 

may be you can do a favour for me. We are participating in a competition for small business from Fedex and to reach the next round of the 10 companies, we need some 'shares', 'likes',.....

 

If you want support us, you can share our profile:

http://de.wettbewerb.fedex.com/Gallery/Detail/13f71e45-8de4-444a-a76f-9c1a36cf5e98

 

Just click here on 'anything':

and share it.

 

Thank you!

[Iskanda]

Finally we started the production and for the 1st machine we choose an unusual color for the facade. Usually the faceade is ordered with "black eloxal" or "brilliant stainless steel".

 

 

More pictures: https://www.facebook.com/Xenia.Espressomaschinen/photos_stream?tab=photos_albums