Iskanda

I appreciate any comment as (after 3,5 year) I became probabaly blind in some cases. Hm....it is an idea which is worth to think about it.

A thermoblock is - as to me - not a stable source of heat. You need i.e. a thermostat to control it. Often a TY60 from Campini is used and this type is having a hysteresis in the worst case of 14°C. At 40° it meight be still the half. I can install a better themostat but it will have at least ~4°C hystersis. It makes the problem worse - and you have this problem probably every day - not only if the climate is very hot. An idea could be to make the tube before the HX longer and 'turn' it around the boiler. But this will cause that the HX will be not empty after a shot. Hm...this could be fixed with an additional 3-way-valve..... May be the best way would be an additonal sensor, as sergio said. But yes: a lot of efforts (for the basic machines) which raises the price ... and with a 'low' infliuence on the result. However we can be open for suggestions and improvements in the future, as we have some liberty concerning the design and features.

We have 1 free slot for a valve on the board and it could be possible. I think your idea is right - this can happen. Measurements with a Scace should be done if we want to try it.

2 x Yes We can do it by software. We have a Solidstaterelais for the pump and we control the pump. But it is not sure that we offer it. May be the Firmware will be published and there will be a community to develop new features. But it is not that we are lazy and want other people do the job. 2 reasons: (1) more involved people = more ideas (2) no danger to violate any existing patents

I don't want to talk about prices or import and I there is no intention to offer the machine in your country or to find a dealer. We are too small to handle it. I tried it some time ago but I was not sure about the influence. I think hot weather is having more influence on the brewgroup than to the water in the tank.

You are right. It will have some influence. But even the variation would be not small...I have no affordable idea do anything against this problem. All machines are 'suffering' this problem and it is a bit like I want to find a solution, against the problem of roasted beans with minor quality The only help I can offer is to isolate tank with a additional layer of i.e. Armaflex against the boiler. But the isolation is already quiet good But is it in Brasil an important problem ?

I was trying to read and understand all the new comments and before I answer some of them, I will explain the main idea of the machine. I run a bit out of time as today the (hopefully last samples of the steel sheet parts arrived and thursday I have the occation to attend the anual meeting of a choir/orchestra in middle Germany and I can offer Espresso and Cappuccino for 4 days. Actually I prepared one Xenia H and I want to build a 2nd Xenia. I hope the rotary pump will arrive early enough. As you already know it the idea was to make only one machine. The idea comes from my profession (software developer) and from the talks with the customers. Often they choose a machine but want to have it with i.e. black manometers. Or with joystick-valves, a.s.o. If this idea is present from the beginning you can take 'everything' in consideration - also a 2nd boiler or a rotary pump. Of corse it is not easy and I don't know how many changes have been made. Some hundred until it was good. A machine with 2 boilers is a great idea but only - as to my opinion - if it is done like i.e. the Dalla Corte Mina. But I think that a machine with 2 boilers and a brewgroup like the E61 is not the best choice because: a lot of material (2nd boiler,...) and a lot of efforts by using sensors and a control units. The result: 1/2 litre of water at 92,2° and when the machine pumps 25 or 50ml to the brew group the little bit water gets in contact with a 3 or 4 kilo 'uncontrolled' brewgroup. What ever was done before this moment to heat up the water to the desired temperature - it is in vain the moment the water enters the group. Based on this consideration of a Dualboiler our idea was to get more control of the brewgroup and use boiler/HX only to pre-heat the water. This job can be done - as to me - by a cheap heat exchanger. An expensive boiler with sensors a.s.o. is not really needed. As HX-machines having one main advantage (overheated water) we empty the HX after each shot. And the HX is very very small (only some ml) we loose not much water - probably much less than a real cool flush. And as the HX is always empty, we have always the condition: cold water for each shot. Here you see the boiler heating and around an old version of the HX: To improve the influence of the brewgroup we have installed in the channel a kind of turbulator. It mixes the water and helps to give the water to the final temperature. We also use 2 heating cartridges for the brew group - but not to control the temperature (for the Version B and H). There is a heavy copper bridge from the boiler to the group. It provides very stable energy to the group. So we use the cartridges only to heat up the heavy group and let the boiler and bridge do the rest: stable temperature. If want you can consider the Xenia as a machine with 2 huge thermo blocs: One is the boiler and one is the brew group. The version DP will work a bit different. We reduce the transfer of energy to the group to the lowest useful temperature (i.e. 90°) and we use a PT100-Sensor and the heating cartridges and Solid State Relays to archive the desired temperature. This is a kind of short term change. If it works for the user the system will try to change the boiler temperature to get by the copper bridge the right temperature for the brewgoup. This may take 10 or 20 minutes - but this energy is nearly for free. If it works - no more need to use the heating cartridges to archive the desired temperature. Actually we don't know if this works as the needed extension board is under development. But we think there is a good chance. Actually we use 2x100 Watt and it is ~22 minutes. Ok. We have steel with a brilliant surface and a bit later9 with a mate surface. You are right. I doubt that there will be a big change. But this is not very important in germany. We have ususally not hot and long summers and so the room temperature is usually ~20°. And there is an option to isolate the tank more (apart from teh fact that it has 5mm walls of glas). But I never tested it. It is a good idea to try it one day. But I expect that 25 or 50 ml water with i.e. +4° will have not much influence on the 3,5 kg of the brewgroup. X like Xylophone. Correct. Just a small change. It is very small. But this will be a secret (as long a possible). I made many many many HX to find the right shape and dimension Yes. We know the parameters. Sometimes parts are having lower taxes (i.e. at Malaysia). That's it for today. Please ask those questions, where I haven't provided a sufficient answer. Or may be someting is unclear - english is not our native language and it is not easy to explain and undertand

It is square...it is a german product But this is also a result of (1) beeing as small as possible and (2) beeing a large as needed. We 'hide' the square case a bit by adding an angle of 15° at the corners. As to me it makes the appearance more 'light'.

I can post again. Thanks to the admin for the support! I have to leave the office soon, but I can post some answers now. 3000 is really too much. It could be an idea to send any machine as collection of parts. May be spare parts are having lower taxes.

It seams that the button 'citar' is no more working for me. I try to answer by using ""

I will explain a bit more this evening or tomorrow Now is time for a Pizza and a

May be - but why ?

Thanks Actually we work on a version where the machine is having rotary pump and water tank as we found a smaller rotary pump. It seams that it can work and the pump is on the way to try it. The version D will be probably not build, as the difference in stability is very very small to the Dual-PID-version (due to the new control board). We can control easily the brewgroup and the boiler the same time (but the control of brewgroup is the main advantage of the concept and that's why we don't use a E61-group). We think: no 2nd boiler is neede but we will try it one day in the near future.

Thank you

Thank you I haven't thought about selling the machine in Brazil - it was just a my pleasure to present it here. I don't know if the dollar is having influence but 80% taxes is a nightmare. However...may be one day. The machine was build because there have been 2 main reasons: We consider it as possible that (1) the existing concepts of machines could be improved without having serious raised costs and (2) we wanted to have a machine which is not very expensive for non-european markets (esp. in Asia for coffee shops, restarurantsa and private persons). The concept allows it to build the machine 'everywhere' and adapt it to the needs. This can fit also to your country

First I want to introduce myself. My name is Holger and I'm living in germany. As I can't speak speak Portuguese, I use English and hope it is ok and you understand me. Since the late 80ths we are in contact with Italian coffee (Espresso) and for some years we imported coffee machines from Italy. Now we developed a coffee machine with some friends over more than 3 years and discussed the features for more than 1 year in the German coffee forum www.kaffenetz.de. The machine is now close to the production and a few days ago I saw on www.kaffenetz.de the nice creation of Gilberto (his grinder and tamper). I asked if I can present our machine here - and here is my first post concerning the 'Xenia'. The Xenia is developed in Germany and will be build in Germany (close to Berlin). Nearly all components are made in Europe (Italy and Germany) - except 3 (glass tank for water, the driptray made of ABS and the ardunio-based control board). We build only this one machine as it covers a wide range of features and wishes. The machine can be used as a kind of basic version (Xenia B, HX-machine) and can be upgraded to the version DP (with 2 PID-controllers). It is also possible upgrade the machine to a dual-boiler - but actually we have no reasons to offer it, as the machine is very stable. However there is space for and additional boiler and the controlboard with a 32bit-processor is able to handle the additional tasks. Apart from the possibility to upgrade the machine, it is possible to customize the machine. We have i.e. a beautiful black faced, handles made of of olive wood or metal. There are joystick-valves for steam and water and you can swap the position of the steam and water valve (fore left-handed persons). The glass tank for water can be lifted or slided out to the left or right (if there are wall cupboards). We made many measurements to find the best stability concerning the brew temperature and we developed a kind of new brewgroup which allows is to have influence of the brew temperature. The machine is not controlled by a standard control box, but by a own developed board which is based on the arduino project (in fact it is a ardunio Due) with a lot of input and output ports. The advantage is that we can implement new features if we want - just by using the arduino-IDE and connect the board by USB to the PC - and we are not depending on a external manufacturer. Even the machine offers a lot of nice feature - it is still a small machine and suitable for many kitchens. We didn't made everything in another way compared to other machines and we don't think that the Xenia is a breathtaking revolution in the coffee business. But we improved several things and we see now that the people in middle Europe like the flexible concept and beautiful small machine. If you understand German, you will find 4 threads on www.kaffeenetz.de with some thousands of comments and proposals: https://www.kaffee-netz.de/threads/x-e-n-i-a.92908/ http://www.kaffee-netz.de/threads/x-e-n-i-a-eine-neue-maschine.87167/ http://www.kaffee-netz.de/threads/x-e-n-i-a-elektronik-und-steuerung.88577/ http://www.kaffee-netz.de/threads/x-e-n-i-a-designfragen.89613/ Our website is providing many information in English: http://truly-coffee.de/index.php/en/ I will try to post some pictures / videos in your photo/video section. But you will find many pictures on facebook (of the machine, of the components and the measurements concerning the brew temperature): https://www.facebook.com/Xenia.Espressomaschinen/photos_stream?tab=photos_albums On vimeo you find a video: If there are any questions concerning the machine - feel free to ask me. I can reply in German and English